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Thread: Templates

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    60

    Default Templates

    I know dody has said he's on the case, but for me (having just installed IndexU and heavily customised the templates) the biggest "quick win" would have to be better templates.

    If I'd read the forum before purchasing, I may well not have bought IndexU.... and with all the work I've put in and changes I've made now, I'd be reluctant to take V4 unless I had absolute assurances that it was backward compatible with my templates.

    But.... as a selling point, make the templates easier - perhaps re-work the user guide.... it's a sure fire hit.

    In fact I might even re-work the user guide myself if I get a day or two spare.... whilst it's all fresh in my mind

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    81

    Default

    I have always thought they would sell more Indexu scripts if they had a couple of professionally designed templates sets to go with them. Just my opinion but I would prefer continued bug fixes and new templates to new features. Indexu has so many features that I end up not using a lot of them anyway.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Atlanta GA
    Posts
    3,395

    Default Re: Templates

    Originally posted by richhead
    having just installed IndexU and heavily customised the templates) the biggest "quick win" would have to be better templates.
    Having done links sites for 3 yrs now, I have learned one thing about links templates: they take a lot time regardless of what condition they are in to begin with ( well almost any condition, and INDEXU's were in pretty good condition ).

    I was actually impressed with how little time I had to spend on INDEXU templates to customize them. Amazed might be a better word to describe the ease.

    I think the INDEXU templates out-of-the-box should be brought to a higher level of compliance. But if we get too compliant we may render the page unusable by the older browsers. And there are still lots of them out there.
    esm
    "The older I get, the more I admire competence, just simple competence, in any field from adultery to zoology."

    .

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    60

    Default

    Actually compliance will benefit all browsers, older (which tend to be more tolerant) and newer, which are dictated to be less tolerant.

    Don't get me wrong... I like IndexU, just took longer and was more convoluted than I'd hoped

    But I'm getting there

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    10

    Default Re: Templates

    Originally posted by richhead
    If I'd read the forum before purchasing, I may well not have bought IndexU.... and with all the work I've put in and changes I've made now, I'd be reluctant to take V4 unless I had absolute assurances that it was backward compatible with my templates.
    I absolutely agree.
    I purchased this script because it was written in PHP and I (mistakenly) thought that it would be easy to add in things of my own, like include a quote of the day, include an ads banner rotator, etc...
    Imagine my frustration when I paid my money, got it installed, and found out that the templates can't handle any php code. Everything has to be hard-coded.

    Then imagine my horror when I find out that the CSS is basically useless, there's more than one CSS styling, there are nearly 100 different template files to look through just to find HARD-CODED font colors, table colors, etc - why even bother using a styling sheet?

    As for older browser compliance - who cares? This is 2003. If someone is still using Netscape 3.0, then too damn bad - the program is nearly 6 years old and just because they don't want to upgrade doesn't mean I should hold my site and all of its users back for a measly 0.5% of visitors who are too stubborn, afraid, or plain STUPID to upgrade their browsers.

    The only reason I keep using this script is because I paid so much money for it. The features are nice, but the lack of attention paid to being able to easily customize the layout is just.... arrghh.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    1,180

    Default more templates

    ai,

    it is not my opionion, that indexu needs more variants of templates !
    If you use the indexu template on your site, sorry, but this is not my way and by the way not my language and I like to have my own style.
    And this means, that I have to change all the templates to use indexu for my site.
    And that is the point, at the moment I'm changing again and there to much templates for noting !
    All the _ok, error or something else templates are nice, but who needs them ?
    My wish is, that the next indexu has not so much templates and more is done with a language file and messages.

    Greetings
    Frank

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    351

    Default Re: more templates

    Originally posted by Frank71
    My wish is, that the next indexu has not so much templates and more is done with a language file and messages.

    Greetings
    Frank
    The main thing that I am interested in is Indexu as a portal software and not actually the templates.

    I agree with Frank - it is better for Dody to concentrate on the actual portal software than making templates that are fancy and flash.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    60

    Default

    I think the point is that the software itself is great, but the templates are poor with very poor implementation of CSS, non compliant HTML etc...

    I await V4 with baited breath

    ;-)

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Atlanta GA
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    Default

    we all have our thoughts on templates. Mine are that folks will have to modify the templates to fit their sites regardless of what state they are in when purchased or the use of css. good html code and css make that process a little more tolerable. It is still a painful process, nonetheless.

    I've probably done about 10 link sites in the past 3 years ( I once had life. Now all I have is a computer, a keyboard, a mouse and a modem! ). Maybe one of these days I'll do one that makes money! Anyway, when I saw the INDEXU code and templates I felt I had died and gone to heaven. No, they were not perfect but I knew that I would not have to spend much time on them either. and in the larger scheme of things, I only had to do it once. So percent of time I have spend on templates vs all of INDEXU continues to drop and will soon be negligible. So I am happy.

    I ran across another links program the other day and I have shared the code for the review page below. In my humble opinion, it is a good argument for separating code and content. Also, I would sure hate to try and make this code compliant with the latest HTML stds. Or to incorporate css into it.

    So there are worse and there are probably better and INDEXU could be better. But all-in-all, "it ain't all that bad." I think it is pretty good.

    apenas mis dos centavos, amigos

    Code:
    <?
    // ******************************** ***********************************
    //  include/review.php
    // ******************************** ***********************************
    $html = $table2 . "<tr><td class=\"whatText\">" . $review_1;
    $html .= "</td></tr></table>";
    echo whattable("100%","center","",$html);
    unset($html);
    $get_site = sql_query("select * from $tb_links where ID = '$SiteID'");
    $site_rows = sql_fetch_array($get_site);
    $average = sql_query("select avg(Rating) as average from $tb_reviews 
    where SiteID = '$SiteID' and Status = 'Show'");
    $av_rows = sql_fetch_array($average);
    $html = $table2 . "<tr><td class=\"regularText\"><font class=\"regularText\">";
    $html .= $review_2 . "</font> <a class=\"regularBoldText\" href=\"out";
    if($user_outer_frame == "Y"){$html .= "_frame";}
    $html .= ".php?";
    $html .= session_name() . "=" . session_id() . "&amp;ID=";
    $html .= $site_rows["ID"] . "\" target=\"_";
    if($user_outer_frame == "Y"){$html .= "top";}else{$html .= "blank";}
    $html .= "\">" . $site_rows["SiteName"] . "</a>";
    if(isset($av_rows["average"])){
      $html .= " - " . $review_3 . "<font class=\"regularBoldText\">";
      $html .= $av_rows["average"] . "</font>";
    }
    $html .= "</td></tr>";
    $get_reviews = sql_query("select * from $tb_reviews where SiteID='$SiteID' 
    and Status='Show' order by Added desc limit 0,10");
    if(sql_num_rows($get_reviews)>0){
      $html .= "<tr><td class=\"regularText\"><br /><ul>";
      while($rows = sql_fetch_array($get_reviews)){
        $html .= "<li><font class=\"regularBoldText\">" . $rows[ReviewTitle];
        $html .= "</font> - " . $rows[Review] . "<br />" . $review_4;
        $html .= $rows[Reviewer] . " - &lt;";
        $secure_email = str_replace("@", $review_5, $rows[ReviewerEmail]);
        $secure_email = str_replace(".", $review_6, $secure_email);
        $secure_email = str_replace("-", $review_7, $secure_email);
        $secure_email = str_replace("_", $review_8, $secure_email);
        $html .= $secure_email . "&gt;";
        if(strlen($rows[ReviewerURL])>0){
          $html .= " of <a class=\"regularText\" href=\"" . $rows[ReviewerURL];
          $html .= "\" target=\"_blank\">" . $rows[ReviewerURL] . "</a>";
        }
        $html .= "</li>";
      }
        $html .= "</ul></td></tr></table>";
    } else {
        $html = $table2 . "<tr><td class=\"regularText\">" . $review_9;
        $html .= "<br /><br /></td></tr></table>";
    }
    echo table("98%","center","",$html);
    unset($html);
    $html = $table2 . "<tr><td class=\"regularText\"><a class=\"regularText\" ";
    $html .= "href=\"index.php?" . session_name() . "=" . session_id();
    $html .= "&amp;show=review_add&amp;SiteID=" . $SiteID . "\">" . $review_10;
    $html .= "</a></td></tr></table>";
    echo table("98%","center","",$html);
    unset($html);
    ?>
    esm
    "The older I get, the more I admire competence, just simple competence, in any field from adultery to zoology."

    .

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    60

    Default

    It's always going to be an immotive subject. When you buy a product that is advertised with "Customize the look and feel of your website with featured templates or create your own styles." you'd expect the customisation to be limited to temnplates....

    Instead I found I had to hack PHP code, numerous templates and try and make some sense of the CSS. Worst of all for me was that the templates were invalid HTML (add the header, body and footer and run that through the W3C validator and it has a fit).

    I love the product (as a portal), I love it's ease once it's up and running (although I get regular MySQL errors - which I'm hoping to resolve by swapping host)... I just hated the extra time it took to get it how the client wanted it.... I'd factored in a few days into my costs to customise and based my cost proposal on that. Instead it took me weeks (time is money).

    I'm waiting with baited breath for V4 and it's new template implementation, I just hope some of these concerns have been taken on board, not least the valid HTML point, remember modern browsers are (dictated by W3C to be) less forgiving of invalid and propriertary HTML.

    Let's get all the HTML into the templates
    Let's validate all the HTML (if pages can be made with combinations of headers, bodies and footers, let's validate ALL permutations)
    Let's get all the CSS into an external stylesheet (that way we really can change the style with changes in ONE file)
    Let's put all the email content in email templates
    And keep all the code in PHP (and only the code)

    Keep it simple and you're on a real winnner!

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