Potential customers read this. Nicecoder is a flaky business.

[Street]

You may have navigated to this website by various happy-go-lucky banners, advertisements promising great value, & made your way to this area to see how things are going.

IndexU offers great potential, does offer a pretty automated existance, a few tacky & a few clever mods to give end users something to 'click' while attempting to monetize your website. Although the skinning ( and I refer to version 5.4.0 ) is horrible, somewhat like trying to skin OSCommerce with there seemingly infinite amount of ununified template files you'll be hard pressed to just purchase a skin to get it looking somewhat decent.

Anyways, the topic at hand is why you should be weary of purchasing any product from Nicecoders at all. As many of you know, products ( especially ones such as scripts & software ) just aren't of value without good customer support. Marketing & sales pitches do not make up for creative backpeddaling after your purchase has been made, this is how businesses end up dwindling away. What I see is Nicecoders policy of double speak, excuses, creative arguements, & outright cheating of its customers to cover its own potential profit at the expense of its customers & the trust their false advertising has created.

I for one do this as a hobby, I'm sure some of you may be gun-ho web developers who spend their time glued to a computer day in and day out checking click through rates, I don't. I don't care how much you have made from your website to help justify Nicecoders policy of axing their customers & their original purchase date agreement simply to bring in more revenue to pay salaries to 'new programmers' they may or may not have.

I currently have a email pending response from nicecoder requesting information as to why I was asked to pay for an upgrade to IndexU Deluxe from 5.4.0 which I am sure will now be met with hostility judging by the responses I see here on the forums from Nicecoder & some of their staff.

If given a promise for free upgrades during the life of my license,I expect to receive free upgrades up & until the final minute of my contract with said company. I'm sure that Nicecoder enjoys using vBulletin's forum software and depending on when they purchased their forum software, are able to go and upgrade to 3.7.0 should they feel the need (and as many times as you WANT without being given grief about how you should've stored a backup during your valid license agreement time).

A reputable & honest company would do just this, honor their agreement and deal with their customers fairly. Telling me, a paying customer that I should just suck it up & continue to use outdated software ( that I paid $299 for ) because the name has cleverly been changed from IndexU to IndexU Deluxe to escape your original agreement with your customers, is wrong by all means. I did not receive a conditional promise from Nicecoder, nowhere on their frontpage advertising did it stipulate that Nicecoder in its infinite wisdom will/can decide to completely avoid its duty to the paying customer by just simply ignoring it. I don't care that the head honcho here doesn't know english well, its not my problem, customer service is a small phrase you CAN understand as well as : theif, crook, hustler. If not, look them up on dictionary.com ( another FREE service with no hidden charges ), actually you should look up FREE while you're their too being that you seem to not understand this term either.

Looking through your forums I see how people are given the run around, told to PM Dody, given obsurd responses as to "how should I know your email", the helpdesk seems to always be out of commission. Here's an idea, remove the system all together & stick to forum support, that is why you have more people working for you correct?! That would of course seem all too easy though, I see your business is built on a logical, honest, & fiscally responsible foundation .

I'm sure I'm not alone here in saying that, if you can't afford your office, have high overhead, or are just pocketing the money, its time to change something on YOUR end or start refunding money to persons who paid for a service they are not receiving. I for one want a refund ( with no pro rated fees considering my software was never really going to be given the FREE updates I was offered ). I no longer want IndexU Deluxe, because I would never want to continue supporting a company that works with this business model, charging more to make up for their own faults & lack of business management skills.

When purchasing software you must understand that by offering service as was once ( long time ago ) offered, you create subservices such as template/skin developers, mod developers, which all help interest & purchaser appeal. However, when your customers have no faith & confidence in your product those outside vendors of services & products also fail & seek to built their businesses around SOUND & STABLE businesses to which they will create longterm customers from.

I see your double talk and honestly stupid arguements defending you screwing people out of their money as a big red flag & I want nothing to do with your company.

I request that you refund me my money due to your false advertising & deceptive customer service practices. I want nothing to do with your software or company.

A few References:
http://nicecoder.com/community/showthread.php?t=6601
http://nicecoder.com/community/showthread.php?t=7402

A List of similar but HONEST companies:
http://www.photopost.com/featuresphp.html#license
http://www.vbulletin.com/docs/html/m..._is_memberarea
http://www.invisionpower.com/communi.../purchase.html

Before you ask or comment if I'm being cheap, oh I CAN pay the $99 upgrade fee, but I WON'T. I didn't buy 11 or whatever licenses to upgrade them all, I bought them expecting to be able to upgrade them at will whenever I felt I neeed to.

[Bruceper]

You do not have a ticket open, unless of course you're trying to hide your identity which I have no doubt that you are.

Judging from what you've said, you purchased IndexU before April, when did you purchase it? If it was less than a year ago then you can upgrade for no cost at all.

You were promised free upgrades of IndexU, IndexU Deluxe is not IndexU. Version 5.41 is available in the client area for you to download all that you want, forever. We are honoring our agreement, which is why when I was just a support monkey, before I because a part owner, before I was offered to manage the company, I fought tooth and nail to get users a version that they could continue to download and use. Sure you can consider this semantics, but legally they were within their right to do this.

No I'm not patting myself on the back, I'l saying the facts here. Dody and John wanted to kill off the 5.x release completely and my actions kept it around so that you still have a product that you paid for and that you can use.

And how am I really supposed to guess someone's email address for the client area unless their forum account email address is the same as the client area? I'm not a magician, I can't pull this information out of my arse.

As for sending messages do Dody that is no longer required. I now have full license access so I can help users myself. Yes that was an issue, and I complained about it constantly. But you haven't heard me say that for about two months now have you?

A lot has changed within the last two months, and more will change. Less than three weeks have gone by since I received my promotion to management and look what's changed. A new site, a new product was released with full documentation, a blog was started (still needs the skin completed, should be done monday), I've implimented a two tier support system and gotten the iDesk programmer to make that possible, released a new version of iDesk with full documentation, proofread three manuals (2 released, one more to come out), started a new program that will be half freeware, half commercial called NiceBackup for cPanel users and already received a demo of the user interface (admittedly users haven't seen that), found at least 5 bugs in iDesk, 2 in IndexU and so much more that I can't remember it all. On top of all that a new release of IndexU Deluxe should be out this week providing that one of the user reported bugs can be duplicated and fixed.

Now that's a lot of change for a company that you say isn't doing anything, sure some of this stuff was in development before I became manager. But without me pushing for change, talking to the programmers every night (sometimes until 3 or 4AM) many of these things would not have been now or even started.

As for a refund, our policy is to offer refunds up to 30 days after purchase. There is no way you fall into this category if you purchased before April. But just for kicks, why you don't you tell me who you really are and I'll look into it. Don't forget, you can always sell your licenses to a third party.

[Street]

For the sake of full disclosure, I have not logged into this website since I first downloaded my product. I don't part take in the conversations because for the most part you should be able to find what you need simply from searching prior posts, so I in no way keep up to whats up to date with this software or the forum. I only have a condensed view as to what I've read in threads I've searched and read regarding certain topics. In your defense I noticed you were since this company switched hands one of the few voices of reason or atleast attempting to resolve issues. Whether an issues gets resolved or not has nothing to do with your caliber of customer service, issues should be resolved regardless. It has to do with the amount of steps taken when seeking assistance.

Similar to calling a service company & getting the run around about the weather, a notation wasn't added to your file, and speaking to several CSR's before getting your issues resolved. Its frustrating. So I'm glad the people you receive orders from have evolved ( although not dynamically ) and granted you access you shoud have had long time ago.

My order# is 5138 ( purchased 2-22-08 ) & email address is streettactic@gmail.com. You can see I still have 2-22-2009 on my year subscription to updates. I should have 8 of my 10 purchased licenses still available. I don't care to open a help ticket, I've emailed you, and you've received my complaint here on this forum. Opening a ticket would simply be another hurdle to jump to get my point across.

If you're going by what your higher-up's are telling you, I understand, trust me. Having to bite your tongue to have a job, but I hope you don't fully sincerely believe IndexU and IndexU Deluxe aren't the same piece of software. They both handle a links exchange service via software licensed to the end user and is easily recognized as the 'latest version' of the IndexU brand. No matter how much BS you serve to your public, I honestly hope you don't believe your own. It is a big game of wordplay & ducking.

And I do expect a refund for breaching our contract. You're not immune as a virtual online business to customer backlash & I hope you realize this.

[Street]

I fought tooth and nail to get users a version that they could continue to download and use. Sure you can consider this semantics, but legally they were within their right to do this.

No I'm not patting myself on the back, I'l saying the facts here. Dody and John wanted to kill off the 5.x release completely and my actions kept it around so that you still have a product that you paid for and that you can use.

Just wanted to point out a few more things. You definitely are tooting your own horn for giving your customers what they had already paid for though. I'd be very concerned with a company that continues to offer & advertise FREE UPDATES! on software they know they won't be updating...You get me ? Looks like cause for concern/fraud if you ask me, no matter what your license agreement or what you feel you were " well within your legal limits to do.

My point is, whenever you want to skip out on your customers, you can just change IndexU to whatever version tickles your fancy!

So to anyone who bought IndexU Deluxe get ready for any/all responsibilities from nicecoder to be null/void once they introduce:

- IndexU Premium
- IndexU Super
- IndexU Super Deluxe
- IndexU Super Duper Deluxe



I wouldn't buy this or any of your future products simply for this one little action alone. A refund will simply shut my trap whenever I see a thread on various other forums asking for customer opinions of your product.

And for anyone looking to buy this and feel comforted by the 30 day money back ( Goodluck ) Guarantee make sure you use no services so you can ACTUALLY get your money back.

6. REFUND. If you're not satisfy with our product, you can ask for a refund in the next 7 days, but if you use the "Free Support" &/or " Free Installation", we'll charge 40 USD for installation and 30 USD / hours for support done.

HackerSafe Tested!
One Year Free Updates
30 Day Money Back Guarantee!
Instant Download
Secure Ordering
Dedicated Support Team
Active Community Forum
IndexU is a mature, proven script with over 6 years of active development progress!

References:
(7 Day refund policy ) http://nicecoder.com/order/client_vi...agreement_id=1
( 30 day money back guarantee ) http://nicecoder.com/indexu.php


So which one is it ?

You better believe I saved copies of everything in PDF format.

[FSGDAG]

Your a sandwich short and a day late to this picknick my friend!

I'm so tired of hearing this argument, its not even funny... Its been beatin to death, resurrected, then killed off about 2 more times!

[Bruceper]

If you emailed me (meaning Nicecoder support) then it would be turned into a ticket, and since I don't have ticket for you then you either

a) haven't emailed me
b) had your email filtered because it got caught by our spam filters

And if in fact you had emailed and it was received you then would get an email back saying a ticket has been created with a ticket number. So where is your ticket response? What is your ticket number?

I'm glad you saved everything as a PDF, and as I said in my first post in this thread our refund policy is 30 days. No idea where the 7 days came from but I'll make sure I fix that tonight.

Yes users did get something that John and Dody had no plans to give. They got version 5.41 which was a bugfix version of v5.40. The entire 5.x line was slated to be killed, and yes it was me that saved the 5.x line and convinced Dody to release 5.41.

As for your license, from what I can tell it is active. Are you receiving an error? I see one active license, it doesn't look like any of the other licenses have been used.

So all of this because you have an issue and then say you sent in an email that we don't have and then you go off on a tangent? Perhaps you should have asked if we got your email first, or posted on the forum about your issue.

I'm still willing to fix the issue if you tell me exactly what the problem is.

Finally, there will be no refund coming. I stand by the policies here and am not going to bend because you demand it and threaten to leave disparaging posts on other forums if you don't get a refund. That's what lawyers call blackmail if you weren't aware.

[Street]

So all of this because you have an issue and then say you sent in an email that we don't have and then you go off on a tangent? Perhaps you should have asked if we got your email first, or posted on the forum about your issue.

First I was "hiding", a laughable assumption, now I'm on a tangent because I possibly didn't send a email that I know I did infact send. I'll do my part and check my filtered emails to see if for some reason it ends up in there. I don't deal with trickery no matter how you would like this to be twisted against me & I personally do not appreciate it.

I'm still willing to fix the issue if you tell me exactly what the problem is.

I will be abandoning the one instance of software I do currently have installed on a server simply because I despise your company. So there is no more issue. I came on to update to the latest version so I could purchase a template for "IndexU Deluxe" only to see I had been sold a foul product.

Finally, there will be no refund coming. I stand by the policies here and am not going to bend because you demand it and threaten to leave disparaging posts on other forums if you don't get a refund. That's what lawyers call blackmail if you weren't aware.

I'll take it as a loss as I haven't had many. Believe me I will take every chance to display my displeasure of ever having done business with your company due to being a PRIOR customer not simply a bystander or competing business attempting to blackball a company with no legitimate prior business relation with them. If its a public forum, its there for that sole purpose, public use to conversate & interact with others within the boundries and guidelines of that website within the topics/threads available for discussion. If ever, a question about your companies product is asked, I will be there to answer it. It's my duty to not allow others to get screwed over.

Why don't you look up Material Breach of Contract or Bait & Switch ( Fraud )

Good luck to you and your fine business here. You're going to need it the way you're going.

[Street]

Your a sandwich short and a day late to this picknick my friend!

I'm so tired of hearing this argument, its not even funny... Its been beatin to death, resurrected, then killed off about 2 more times!

Sorry I'm not willing to be a complacent cheerleader. This topic should be brought up with more frequency & at the very minumim complaints should be submitted to PayPal ( from anyone who paid via paypal ) as I have done regarding this software developers tactics. I'm glad others have been smart enough to see through the BS.

[FSGDAG]

Sorry I'm not willing to be a complacent cheerleader

It has absolutely NOTHING to do with being complacent. Your arguments are nothing new! They've been said over and over again.

I have not logged into this website since I first downloaded my product. I don't part take in the conversations because for the most part you should be able to find what you need simply from searching prior posts, so I in no way keep up to whats up to date with this software or the forum. I only have a condensed view as to what I've read in threads I've searched and read regarding certain topics.

By your own admission, you dont read the forum regularly and stay up to date on whats happening with IndexU and NiceCoder. So what is it... Did you just figure this out now that NiceCoder changed their licensing requirements??? Or are you bored and needed something to do??? I go back to my original statement... Your a sandwich short and a day late!!!!!

[Bruceper]

That's how you feel then no one can take that away from you. You may feel free to do your duty where ever you please, but if you choose to interfere and/or abuse our forum you may just find your posts removed.

I'm a liberally minded person that believes everyone should get their say, whether they are right or wrong.

I find it unfortunate that you chose not to allow me to help you resolve your issue since by your license date you are entitled to the product you want at no cost. You would rather complain than resolve the issue. Good luck with your future endeavours.

Thread closed