Is a point system in the works?

[krogers66]

I recently downloaded the free version of IndexU to evaluated. So far I am pretty impressed and will be purchasing soo. I read this thread and it peaked my interest. Has or will a point system be in the works for any future versions? It would be very helpful.

Thanks,
Kimberly

[Bruceper]

You replied to an old thread that was in the v3.2 section. The current version is 5.4.

No points system is available at the moment, although there is a possibility of someone doing a mod for it.

[krogers66]

Good morning,

Thank you for the reply. I apologize for posting in the wrong section and will be sure to pay attention to that next time.

Regards!

[esm]

You replied to an old thread that was in the v3.2 section...

when you move a thread like this, I feel like I have come into the middle of the conversation and have no clue as to what was said prior to this.

Maybe he posted to a totally unrelated thread, which would make it a candidate to be moved. Maybe he posted to an old thread that had a lively discussion but it was to a prior version, in which case I would still like to read what was said previously.

I did a search in the 3.2 forum for the word "point" and found 52 threads, none of which had a subject that seemed to relate to a "point" system feature." A search for "point system" in the 3.2 forum yielded no results. If I search all the forums, I get 17 results. Since none of the subjects of those 17 seem to relate to a "point system," I would have to read thru each until I found the appropriate one. But what if the original thread used the term points feature or points mod or points option...??? I may never find the thread you moved this from.

Some of the forums I visit actively move threads. Some never move threads. I would suggest that if you move a thread, you at least include a link back to the original thread. At least then we could read what you read, if we so desire.

The point is, while you had the opportunity to read the old thread and know what was said, the rest of us did not. Maybe it was not important. Maybe it was important. You know but the rest of us will not know.



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[Bruceper]

It was a reply to a thread for version 3.2, which is a way old version, it was a very old thread, the version is no longer supported, and is unrelated to the version the user was asking about (indexu 5.4).

I totally understand what you mean about moving posts, but there was no loss of discussion by moving the post. I try to make sure there's no loss of discussion when I move threads or posts.

I typically include an expiring redirect when I move a post/thread as well, but usually limit those to 24 hours. I will increase that redirect time to 1 week.

[esm]

I totally understand what you mean about moving posts, but there was no loss of discussion by moving the post. I try to make sure there's no loss of discussion when I move threads or posts.

so, which thread was it???

While I certainly respect your opinion, it is possible that someone else could have a different opinion about the value of a particular thread.

I typically include an expiring redirect when I move a post/thread as well, but usually limit those to 24 hours. I will increase that redirect time to 1 week.

I have no clue as to what an "expiring redirect" is. I've never seen anything on any of the posts that have been moved. While I don't know what a "expiring redirect" is, if it leads back to the original thread then anything less than "forever" is useless. What happens to those who come after that first week?

Since you bring up the issue of the v3.2 being old and unsupported, I would like to point out that v3.x was the version immediately prior to v5.x. there was no version 4.x.

And version 3.x and v5.x are not that much different. I learned v3.2 almost as well as dody. In comparing the code between v3 and v5, I find that about 85 percent of the code is same between the two versions. Take out the SMARTY templates and the code could be about 95% the same.

But you can answer one question that I think has become important. When the next version comes out shortly, will v5.4 no longer be supported? Will the non-support be effectively immediately or will it occur at some specified time after the new release (and if so, what time will that be)?


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[Bruceper]

I don't remember which post it was, but that's not the point. It was completely offtopic to the post that it was on when considering everything involved (version, time elapsed, and forum location).

An expiring redirect looks like a post in a forum, except that when you click it, you are taken to where the post was moved to. After x days that redirect disappears. However it does say Redirect beside the post.

Dody doesn't want to offer support for v3.2 for a number of reasons. One, because of it's age. Lets face it, it really is old in "internet" age (released Aug 20 2004). Two, because of it's age there are issues with newer versions of php and mysql (there are some with the current version too). Third because of piracy issues.

Anyone can download 3.2 off the net at any time they want and then they come here looking for support. The same goes with some 5.x versions as well (5.01 mostly, which as we know has exploits so it sucks to be them). Version 5.2 and 5.3 are also available out there

Version 5.4 WILL be supported after 6.x comes out. Do you want an exact timeframe? I'd say support for 5.4 will probably be at in the range of 6-12 months after 6.x comes out. Dody may have a different answer than that. He's the boss and I mostly need to go with what he says.

I think 6 months should be more than enough time to move a site over and learn the features of the new version.

[esm]

I don't remember which post it was, but that's not the point. It was completely offtopic to the post that it was on when considering everything involved (version, time elapsed, and forum location).

No disrepsect intented, but I learned a long, long, long time ago not to just accept what someone else tells me. While I am not from the state of Missouri, I certainly subscribe to her motto of "Show me."

An expiring redirect looks like a post in a forum, except that when you click it, you are taken to where the post was moved to. After x days that redirect disappears. However it does say Redirect beside the post.

So, an expiring redirect is pretty much useless if you are reading the new post that was created from the move.

well, I would hope that you post a link to the old post in the new post.

Dody doesn't want to offer support for v3.2 for a number of reasons. One, because of it's age. Lets face it, it really is old in "internet" age. Two, because of it's age there are issues with newer versions of php and mysql (there are some with the current version too). Third because of piracy issues.

Same old dody. All three of those arguments are bogus.

Age has nothing to do with software, internet or otherwise. There is an old saying when it comes to computers, ANY software running on your computer (including that from the internet), is obsolete. Are you willing to accept a company's claim that it will not support your software if it is more than xxx years old...? Think of the thousands of programs on your own computer that fall into that category. Do I think software has a shelf-life? Yes, but just because you issue an new version is not in and of itself a reason to not support the prior version(s). Support is one of the reasons why I got out of the "INDEXU" business. It is very difficult. I still support what I sold but I am no longer creating and selling new stuff.

Like I said, bogus.

And I stand by my comment that there is only about a 15% difference in the code between v3.2 and v5.x. What's so hard about supporting that...??? Besides, why not take one of those "7 programmers" and tell him "you support v3.x." I haven't looked at v3.2 in months and I could easily do it. Not to mention there are not that many questions anyway. Should it have a shelf-life? Probably, but not yet. And there is little difference between v5.0 and v5.4. So what is not to support there. The issue of security is not a reason to not support a version. Sercuity patches are issued all the time.

Like I said, bogus.

Then the issue of piracy. Is there something about v5.x that I am not aware of...? Does v5.x have some special encoding that prevents others from coping v5.x...? I don't think so. If you are thinking about that "registering the software" feature, then you have not looked at the code. I don't even know why dody added that. It is a joke. It would take me all of 10 seconds to bypass that feature and I don't even have any desire to sell prirated software.

Like I said, bogus.

I've said it before but it bears repeating. A new version always poses a dilemma to current owners. Do I upgrade to the latest and greatest version and lose all the mods/changes/hacks I've invested time and money into with my current version? OR do I bite the bullet and install the lastest version with all those fancy new features. You suggest 6 months is long enough to support the old version. But how would you feel if you had just finished customizing your newly purchased version of INDEXU and spent several hundred hours and possibly hundreds of dollars to get it the way you wanted it, only to find that it would no longer be supported in xxx number of months...???


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[Bruceper]

You do of course realize that I'm going to eventually move these posts away from this thread because you've taken the thread totally off topic right?

Seriously, you sound so bitter I don't know why you're still here. Yes you make absolutely valid points, and I never once said I disagree with you, but you have to realize that it's not up to you or me what happens with the script. It's up to Dody and John.

Lets be honest and say that when Dody put Nicecoder up for sale you or I or anyone else could have bought it, and make the changes we (when i say we I mean anyone) wanted. But we didn't buy it for whatever reason. The opportunity was there, it wasn't taken.

I hate to break it to you, but upgrades happen with software all the time that breaks current/former functionality. This is why SVN exists so users can compare changes. Now of course you'll say that not everyone knows how to use SVN and you'd be right, but that is what it's there for.

I have made dozens of recommendations on what should happen with the script, and many of them are being done. Changes include keeping settings in the database so they aren't lost during an upgrade, an easy way to change the character set in the admin panel (including database) and a lot more.

I have the user in mind when I send these ideas to Dody, and hopefully the changes will result in something that is a lot more upgrade friendly. One of the biggest issues is with themes. Theme upgrades will _always_ require users to re-add their mods that change the "look" of the page/site.

vBulletin probably has the best system out there for upgrades. Yet for each new version if you want to use your custom theme with the new features you must make changes to the theme. There's just no way around it.

As for calling support for older versions "bogus" I somewhat agree. I'm looking for a way to have the forum verify who actually has a valid license and who doesn't. If this could be done then there wouldn't be an issue with wondering who was real and who wasn't.

I have found a way to do it recently, but haven't spoken to Dody about it yet. And one drawback is that is will work for new signups on the forum only. However I'm having issues with the vBulletin site right now so I can't see a lot of stuff there. My last renewal says "expires: Apr 14th '08" but I cant log in. Ah well, gotta wait for them to fix that so I can carry on.

[Bruceper]

Holy crap is vBulletin support fast. Less than 5 minutes to respond and fix the license issue.

[esm]

As a forum moderator you are free to move any post you care to. All I asked is that when you move a post, you include a link back to the original post if it is appropriate (which in this case it probably is not appropriate. but to retain the character of any one of these posts, you would really need to move several of the them to the new thread). Expiring redirects do not address that issue.

All of my suggestions were to benefit either the software or the folks who use it. Once again you are free to characterize that anyway you like.

The discussion was not about breaking or not breaking the software. It was about supporting older versions after a new version comes out.

And what does buying the software have to do with anything? Dody offered v3.2 to me for $3,500 back in 2003 and I turned him down. Why would I want to spend $30,000 for it last year. You seem to suggest since I didn't buy it when it was available for sale last year, that I have no right to have a different opinion on matters affecting the software and that I don't have "the user in mind" when I do state that difference.

But enough said on this subject. We are beating a dead horse. Time to close this thread.



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[Bruceper]

I don't think it's beating a dead horse, which by the way sometimes can help you feel better.

I spoke about buying the software because it was at that time that you or I or anyone else could have taken it and done whatever they wanted, including sales, support or upgrades.

I didn't mean to imply that you have no right to have an opinion. What I meant was that if you had bought it (or I or anyone else) it would have been up to "us" as to what happens. What's happening now is Dody's opinion and I've told him what I think of some of his policies. Some are too rigid, others aren't rigid enough.

As for the future, you should be getting a newsletter soon with some news that you should really like to hear.

Almost forgot. I'll do my best to include a "moved from" reply on posts that I split.